The Detective Novelist

In this episode I talk to award winning Zimbabwean author Bryony Rheam about her writing process behind her two novels ' That September Sun" and latest All Come To Dust.

This is a podcast where we talk art and art processes. Don't forget to like, share and subscribe!

Transcript

wesley: [00:00:00] Hey, good and swirl. This is Wesley Pepper. Yeah. And this is my podcast with the Peppers art Lexia, and is brought to you by Spudcaster and Baobulb. Um, and, uh, on that, uh, yo man, this is like recording of my 50th episode. Like. 50. So a big up despite Spudcaster and Baobulb being there, like they listen to my voice for 15 weeks.

[00:00:34] Right. Um, yeah, I'm sure. I'm sure they certainly have an ear full, um, big up to them for all of that, that I think that's quite an achievement for both of us. Um, And yeah, man, as you know, I've been talking up the whole thing of a giveaway, which I'm doing a 52nd episode and more beautiful follow at the outro.

[00:00:57] Uh, before we move on to today's episode, uh, first of all, big ups to violet. For coming through, uh, last week, like Mulberry dreams. Uh, really interesting, man. I think I really enjoyed speaking to, uh, um, about, uh, yeah man, I thought the way we, uh, spoke last week that we'll be back, uh, both as a brand or as a writer, you know what actually.

[00:01:24] Great. It was great. Uh, so thanks for coming. Um, um, to that, and on that, we're gonna kind of keep on that, um, lighter theme. Should I call it or at least today's and Allison barber and the writer, um, and she tours all the way from Bulawayo. So we spoke in to Bryony, Rheem. Order them. I'm not sure if I pronounce his surname correctly, we'll find out.

[00:01:49] Yeah, man. It should be in pronouncing names. Yeah. Um, yo man, she's pretty interesting. I she's, I'm going to be talking a little bit about, well, She's a, um, she's an award winning, um, I'm a writer and, um, she's just released her second book. Um, my second, um, novel and we'll be unpacking both that novel, but also a first one, the, of the September side and or this.

[00:02:11] September 2nd, it was better this way. Just thing, because the book actually got translated into Arabic. So that was, I find that really interesting. So we talking a little bit about that latest book or come to task, um, a little bit about highlighting what inspired and you know, she's based in Zim. Um, and you know what I, on this platform, I'm always interested in, uh, focusing on the artists.

[00:02:29] Processes and how they pretty much take their environment and interpret what, uh, you know, what's happening around them. And, and, and like, do you, my brothers and sisters from Zimbabwe, you know, like I've got much love for them, what they're doing there. So, uh, we will unpack a little bit about that if that, and to see what future project to use and so on and so on.

[00:02:50] And so I'm, yeah, I'm at least we'll back, um, or rather look forward to all of that. And, um, Yeah, I'll talk to you guys at the end of the episode, uh, with advice for future episodes and yeah, man, that's the 50th one. So I feel, I feel kind of that's a long week, 50, 50 weeks is a long time. It's a, it's a long time given that, um, you know, like this, um, this art thing, um, you know, we pretty much work as freelancers and to do something for 50 weeks on, on one, I think is quite a phenomenal achievement.

[00:03:21] So yeah, I mean, I think it's all the new listeners. Um, you know, and remember, you can always catch me on all my, uh, social media pages. So that's, where's the Pepper at Twitter.  Twitter, Facebook and Instagram underscore Pepper underscore. So, yeah, but I'll, uh, talk more about all those other interesting things at the end of the episode.

[00:03:43] I hope you guys, uh, enjoyed today. You know, I'm definitely looking forward to it and, um, Yeah, man. It's um, let's see what Brian has to say. So stay tuned for that. 

[00:03:55] Spudcaster: [00:03:55] Baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling. This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including Apple and Google podcasts podcast, your life with  baobulb.org.

[00:04:12] wesley: [00:04:12] Okay, so we are recording. Uh, hi Bryony. Oh yeah. We had a bit of technical embarrassment there, but it's all sorted out now. Thanks for coming through. And, um, I guess let's just start off like, uh, firstly, I know you had a, um, you had a break, was it in some way? Uh, for like a few days or was it a week or so?

[00:04:33] So you should feel refreshed. Um, so how are you doing, you know, how are you doing the Sunday morning? 

[00:04:40] Bryony: [00:04:40] Yeah, I'm, I'm actually, I'm feeling really great. Um, you know, as you say, I've been away for a few days. Um, we went up to the Eastern Highlands in Zimbabwe and. It was just great, you know, just wonderful to get away and, um, actually leave for the first time in over a year, I think.

[00:05:01] Um, so that was good. 

[00:05:02] wesley: [00:05:02] Yeah. No, that I can, you definitely sound quite chilled out. Um, so, um, yeah man, like for my listeners, um, you know, since you FaceTime on this platform, um, just so just give us a, uh, Just a brief, I know that you were, uh, you were an award winning writer and we're going to be unpacking, uh, both novels.

[00:05:23] Uh, what's the emphasis on the, on the, on the last one. Cause it's, um, It's out now. Um, but yeah, man, um, we're going to focus on your, uh, journey as I'd like to as well. So just the listeners, like where did the writing bug start? You know, um, like how long have you been writing for, um, that type of thing and, uh, sort of like, um, the, the, the story up until you became a full-on or full-time, um, or published.

[00:05:50] Bryony: [00:05:50] Um, okay. Well, I, you know, I've always, always loved writing and, um, And I can even remember, uh, being probably about grade one, you know, any about six years old and I would write little stories, um, and actually make them into books, you know, sort of, um, get the old state lout and, and make these little books.

[00:06:13] So I've always had that, that, um, desire to write. Um, I mean, um, when I was about 11, my dad worked me a typewriter. Um, I'm one of those old ones. And I used to love, you know, sort of sitting there thinking that I was right. Um, and, and also, you know, even then I started, I actually started sending stuff off to publishes and that never got any way.

[00:06:42] Of course. I mean, I was far too young, um, and, uh, Then I suppose, you know, there was stuff at school, you know, writing for competitions and all that kind of thing. Um, but it will, although I always wanted to be a writer. There was a kind of feeling that I still needed to do something else, you know, um, be a journalist or be a teacher or whatever, you know, I think that there's a funny thing with a writer.

[00:07:10] It's not like you just leave school and you become a writer, you know, it's, uh, it's not like other jobs. Um, so, uh, you know, I was, I went to university, I studied English literature and all that kind of thing. And, um, I suppose it really wasn't until I was about, maybe about 22. Two 23, um, that I actually started writing stuff down and keeping a notebook.

[00:07:36] Um, and I used to actually just write anything down, things that happened during the day. It was people at seed and, um, I was off to university. I went to London for a bit and I, I did what so many Zimbabweans do. You know, you, you share a house with about 25 other people so that your rent is very minimal.

[00:07:59] You know, you have to share a room in a room with people and you know, and I'm not, I'm not the kind of, I'm pretty, I'm pretty much a person who has lots of space. So, um, what happened there is I, you know, I followed this refuge in my writing, you know, I would, I had, you know, my bed was my only space. And so I used to lie on the bed writing and, and that's actually where I started my first novel, which was the September sun, um, you know, just from those snippets that writing down.

[00:08:35] Um, but then my first short story was, was published. Um, Uh, actually before anything else, you know, I, I, um, I just saw an advert one day. It was in the art gallery and they were looking for short stories for an anthology. So I, you know, I wrote the short story and, and actually I think everything really came from that because, you know, after that, I started going to writing workshop and, you know, um, Really thinking about that, being a writer.

[00:09:11] Hmm. 

[00:09:11] wesley: [00:09:11] Interesting. Tell us about the short story. What was the title and what was it about? 

[00:09:16] Bryony: [00:09:16] So, um, the title of the short story was the cue. And, um, it, it was actually based on an incident that I'd seen a few years before where I was, um, at a post office. Um, and there was a, there was a queue of people, you know, getting stuff done and, um, There was this elderly, the elderly lady in front of me.

[00:09:40] And, uh, you know, we'd been queuing a while and this guy just walked in. He walked into the post office, he went straight to the cashier and he started, you know, doing all his business and whatever. And of course we all started looking at each other, like, you know, this guy has just jumped the queue. We've all been standing here and, um, And, uh, but of course, as usual, nobody sort of says anything, you know, but this old lady, she, she, she went for the sky, you know, and she kept, she started shouting at him.

[00:10:12] She kept saying, this is a cue. This is a cue. We've all been queuing, you know, get to the back of the queue. And then she started having a go at the cashier saying, you know, why, why was she serving this man? When he, she knew that he had just walked in and jumped the queue. And so this, this incident had stayed with me.

[00:10:31] And, uh, when I saw this advert, I sort of thinking about the story that had always been sort of knocking around in my mind. And so I wrote it from the point of view of the old lady, you know, like, um, that's terrible day that she's having and all this kind of thing and how she got to this point where she just lost her.

[00:10:55] wesley: [00:10:55] Interesting. Interesting. I have, I have I've I've two questions. Uh, one sort of an observation type of question thingy. Um, and I guess Island's a little follow on, on that. So, uh, just to rewind it, but you were saying that, um, Um, you know, you had like this journal, you know, that should drop down thoughts.

[00:11:14] And I know that's, that's a very personal space personally. I also had, um, you know, she used to keep something of that. So it's, I kind of know the it's real personal thing. So, um, and I know, and I'm assuming, yeah. And I kind of want you to comment on that. Um, That those thoughts are the features of like what's happening around you, is that correct?

[00:11:32] So you're talking about your experiences every day and, and, and, and that type of thing. So what I wanna, what I kinda wanna know, because if I must relate that to your, um, to the, to the short story, the Q a it's a personal experience. And if you say you're writing from the old ladies, um, I know that in Africa, uh, queuing is a part of everyone's, uh, Mondays you're in the higher end bracket.

[00:11:55] Of course. Uh, uh, I guess daily routine at Saks personally, I hate you. I hate you as, uh, I really like to avoid them at all costs sometimes even drastically. Um, so, so I sort of understand those, the frustration and, and, and, and it's a real, it's a real African thing, actually. So, um, my question is, um, Um, um, um, uh, um, and you know, this, this, this is before we get to the September song, because you said you were, you started to write that, that a similar process as well.

[00:12:28] So what is it about your everyday experiences? Uh, you know, uh, I guess sticks out for you, you know, and like, Um, you know, as, as, yeah, in, um, in, on, on the continent, you know, we got a very, or you, you basically, you have to be political. Yeah. Even if you're not, you have to be in that type of thing. So I guess what I'm asking you is what is it about tricks, you know, much everyday experiences that really grabs you and, and, and, um, uh, you know, Saudi that eventually finds its way into a novel.

[00:13:00] Yeah, 

[00:13:00] Bryony: [00:13:00] it's, it's quite an interesting thing. You know, I love, I love being an observer. Um, you know, uh, one thing I really liked doing is, you know, going into a cafe or, um, you know, sitting in a, in a public place and just watching people probably sounds a bit creepy, but, um, you know, just, uh, people watching.

[00:13:22] Um, you know, I think that the just ordinary everyday life is interesting. You know, you, you don't always have to have, um, a story with, um, you know, aliens landing and, um, uh, you know, some great gold, you know, everyday life was just full of character. And people and, you know, and that's what life interesting, you know?

[00:13:50] So sometimes it's just that, that observation of the way people act, you know, or react, um, you know, uh, that the sayings that they use, the way they talk, um, you know, different kinds of people, um, you know, that's, I think that's what I really liked. Observing. Um, and you know, I suppose, you know, if you want to sort of look at things politically, you know, it's, it's also interesting to look at the way, um, uh, I suppose different people of different races react to different situations, you know, how you get that whole range of people again.

[00:14:26] And, um, but, but to me, I think what, what is most important is, is the personal, you know, the, the, the person I think is, you know, um, The most important thing to, to be looking at. 

[00:14:43] wesley: [00:14:43] Interesting. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. I, I can actually relate to that. Um, there's um, there's something I picked up, uh, when I, when I was reading up about you, um, is that you use Agatha Christie enthusiastic.

[00:14:55] Right? So, um, personally I've never did any of her books, but I definitely know a lot about, and I'm as funny. Um, I actually did some water heating up on Agatha Christie, cause I, I like to know things, man. Um, and, um, I was trying to find kind of find, uh, similarities between her writing and your books, because I know she was famous for being a detective writer.

[00:15:20] And, um, I know like in that year, when she was around, I mean like women basically at are very few positions in power or influence and she was right up there. So, um, If I didn't have also there that she sold like over a billion copies, which is wow. Okay.

[00:15:42] Did it leave a note? Right. This can sell that amount. Um, so, um, I found really interesting that she was the scenario. Um, uh, I mean she has a commercial shop. Like explosion. Um, so what is it about, uh, uh, you know, what is it about our writing? Um, I know, you know, she's a detective and I know you also follow with some of the genre and I kind of want to get to that.

[00:16:05] Um, because it's because I find it interesting that you saying you look at the individual. So I thought that's why, let me bring this question up and see how. Yeah. What relationship or what is it about Agatha Christie's writing, you know, your, uh, perception of the world, your processes? How do those two worlds meet?

[00:16:22] And I guess what's the, what's the, what's the style of writing and what's the, yeah. Anyway, I'm asking to you, it's just, um, yeah, just,

[00:16:35] Bryony: [00:16:35] it's so difficult sometimes to. Explain why I like her writing so much. Um, I think, um, It's the puzzle. It's the puzzle that she, you know, that she obviously has in her story, the way that you know, what I've learned, um, through, through reading. So many of her books now is that like, you've, you've got to constantly be alert from, from day one.

[00:17:00] You know, that she's always, even before someone's been murdered or whatever, she's, she's giving you all these clues all the time. And she does it in such a way that. Not to actually drawing attention to the fact that, Oh, look, this is a clue, you know, you need to be, you need to be aware of this. It's, it's all, um, it's almost like a picture in which you have to find a few things that are hidden, you know?

[00:17:25] Um, so I like that scenes. I like the puzzle, you know, I like trying to work out, um, who did it and also to sort of try and see if I can pick out those clues, you know, the right. Um, because obviously lots of wrong crews, um,

[00:17:49] is actually the, the, again, the character, the way she draws characters know creates characters. I really, really like that. Um, uh, Uh, you know, she created very specific people and, um, uh, they're quite memorable, you know, some books see, you know, you can read them. Um, but I, but I, I think characters tend to stand out.

[00:18:15] Um, um, and, um, yeah, I, I think I admire that about her. 

[00:18:21] wesley: [00:18:21] Yeah. So, so I would assume like in your books you also have a very similar process with the come see your main characters. Is that correct? You, um, you're like even your readers clues in your, in the, in the first few chapters. 

[00:18:36] Bryony: [00:18:36] Yeah. I like to think that I've, you know, I've been doing that, you know, to, um, to sort of, uh, Yeah, drop, drop those clues, but also sort of some maybe misleading conditions as well.

[00:18:49] Um, as clever as she, she really does. 

[00:18:59] wesley: [00:18:59] Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, there was another thing. Um, it actually. I wanted to ask you this in the beginning, but I just thought that I wanted to jump that Agatha Christie thing now, because of what you said earlier on, uh, they say into that in 2017, uh, you were one of the five recipients for the miles, uh Farland foundation.

[00:19:19] And from what I can understand, you had a chair out, quite a lot of words, um, into that. Uh, or as, uh, as part of, um, being selected for that. Um, so what, um, um, what book or novel, or why did you write about, um, as part as, um, as part of being part of, um, be selected as part of that foundation? 

[00:19:41] Bryony: [00:19:41] Um, okay. So yo, um, now at this point I had, um, the September stuff already published.

[00:19:50] Um, and I'd actually finished writing. I'd finished writing all come to dusk, but it was still being edited. Um, so the book that I chose to write, um, I've actually finished it now. Um, and it's with the publishers and they are, you...