Member Matt Rogers Shares Land Academy Success Stories (LA 986)
Transcript:
Steven Butala: Steve and Jill here!
Jill DeWit: Hello!
Steven Butala: Welcome to The Land Academy show, entertaining land investment talk. I’m Steven Jack Butala.
Jill DeWit: And I’m Jill DeWit, broadcasting from sunny Southern California.
Steven Butala: Today, Jill and I talk with member extraordinaire, Matt Rogers, and he shares his success stories, hopefully, and maybe some of the reason why he got here. That’s really what I’m interested in.
Jill DeWit: Exactly!
Steven Butala: Before we get into it, I would love to… actually, this is the question. Love to know how you got here. And don’t leave out any details!
Matt Rogers: In the summer of 2017, I had taken a break from television producing, which I had been doing for 15 years, and was just kind of burnt out with the travel. I had been on the road for almost 10 years and had some great experiences, met a ton of cool people, have a million awesome stories to tell at parties. But at the end of the day, I didn’t really have a ton to show for it.
Matt Rogers: The money was good, but when you’re on the road that much, you get burnt out after a while. So, I started looking for ways I could work less in production and do something more for myself, and I started just digging into bigger pockets and figuring out different real estate avenues, things that could… You could get in with not a ton of money, and it kept coming back to land. And honestly, there’s three or four kind of main educators in the space, and with you and Jill being one of them, I just started listening to podcasts, and kind of connected with you guys and listened for a couple of months, tore through all the podcasts.
Matt Rogers: And just decided to join. I joined in September of 2017, and just said, “You know what? Let’s give this a shot and see what we can do.” And I had about $10,000 I wanted to kind of ante in with, and just see where it could take us.
Steven Butala: What’s your bank balance now, Matt?
Matt Rogers: It’s a little more than 10,000.
Steven Butala: Oh, wait, we need to hear… What was the answer? I didn’t hear that.
Jill DeWit: He just said, “A little more than 10,000.”
Steven Butala: 12,000’s good.
Matt Rogers: No, it’s been a pretty crazy ride for the last, oh, I think we’re going on a little under a year and a half now, and honestly, the first three or four months was just almost dipping your toe in the water. And kind of testing for reason, as you like to say, and just making sure that you weren’t going to lose a ton of money or just want to make sure it works!
Jill DeWit: Yeah.
Steven Butala: What does a television producer really do? Every time I see it on a credits, in the before and after anything we watch, it’s like, “Produced by X,” and I just, my initial reaction is, “Yeah, they just put a bunch of money into that thing, and that’s it.”
Matt Rogers: There’s those type of producers. Those are usually on movies and things like that, executive producers, people that just are the money people.
Jill DeWit: Okay.
Matt Rogers: As we know, what we do, there’s money people in our business, too. And on my level, I did more of unscripted things, like Travel Channel, Food Network, HGTV shows, so I would run with a small team. I would usually have a couple of camera people, an audio guy, maybe a couple of assistants, and my job was to direct and also make sure all the logistics were in place while we were on location.
Matt Rogers: Basically, I was the boss. It all fell on my shoulders, and we would sink or swim based off of my leadership.
Steven Butala: Like, make sure people show up and stuff?
Matt Rogers: Make sure the talent shows up on time, make sure they know what to do, make sure the crew shows up. When you’re on location out wherever across the country or across the world, and some people go out and have late nights so you’ve got to make sure they show up the next day! In whatever condition they’re in.
Matt Rogers: So, there’s all kinds of… It’s basically adult babysitting. I’ll just put it simply.
Steven Butala: That completely explains why you’re so good at buying and selling real estate.
Jill DeWit: Yeah!
Steven Butala: Because that’s what this is. That’s what we do. Jill and I-
Jill DeWit: Deal babysitting.
Steven Butala: Jill and I babysit our staff. I mean, I’m not afraid to say it, because they listen to this stuff now.
Jill DeWit: [inaudible 00:04:00] Yeah.
Steven Butala: We babysit our staff, and you babysit these real estate deals.
Jill DeWit: Yep.
Steven Butala: We were ready to go out to dinner last night.
Jill DeWit: Yep!
Steven Butala: And we’re signing stuff, trying to figure out how to print stuff off like it’s 1968, and sign it and scan it and send it back.
Jill DeWit: Because they didn’t give me a DocuSign, which is silly, but, yep.
Steven Butala: That’s what this business really is, truthfully.
Jill DeWit: Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Matt Rogers: It’s amazing how many parallels there are between what I did and what this is. This is obviously a lot more data-driven, but I thrive more in the people aspect of it, and that part of it is kind of what I feel like has really helped me out in being able to do a fair amount of deals in a little over a year.
Steven Butala: Right before we started this episode with you, I turned to Jill and I said this:
Jill DeWit: Yep.
Steven Butala: “I am fascinated and vastly respectful,” because you and Jill have the same… you approach real estate investment and flipping properties, it’s the same way. It’s all very personal, personality and person-based. And I’ve spent the last 30 years devising these systems so that I don’t have to talk to anyone. That’s what the [inaudible 00:05:11] was.
Jill DeWit: [crosstalk 00:05:11]
Steven Butala: And then you guys just, you have no problem diving right in.
Jill DeWit: Pick up the phone.
Steven Butala: And calling people and saying, “You’re going to buy the property or you’re not going to buy the property,” or whatever. So, that’s really what I wanted to talk about with you today. Were you born with that? Were you like that in grade school?
Matt Rogers: No, not at all. And in fact, it wasn’t until… I’m originally from Indiana, and went to college there at Indiana, moved out to LA in ’03, and got into the television production world and it took a few years of really kind of grinding the way. And I started as a production assistant, where you’re doing all the dirt work and you’re just kind of doing what anyone tells you to do. And you have to kind of suck it up and deal with it, or you’re probably not going to work.
Matt Rogers: After a couple of years of that, you kind of start developing a thick skin, and then you have to… It’s all relationship-driven, you know? Pretty much everything is. But especially in the entertainment world, everything that’s production-driven, aside from camera people, editors and audio people, there’s not people with a ton of skill.
Matt Rogers: It’s all who you know and who knows you, and besides that, it’s all personality-driven.
Steven Butala: The three of us are sitting in front of a camera right now producing audio and video, and we have no skill, I can say.
Jill DeWit: Yeah. But we showed up!
Steven Butala: Yeah, we’re here on time.
Jill DeWit: We’re here!
Steven Butala: We started the thing on time.
Jill DeWit: [crosstalk 00:06:38] and we-
Matt Rogers: That’s another thing, too, showing up! Right? Just show up and turn the mics on, turn the cameras on, and you’re beating 90% of the rest, right?
Steven Butala: That’s it!
Jill DeWit: Exactly! Yep.
Steven Butala: My favorite book is by Bill Gates Sr., Bill Gates’ father, called Showing Up For Life. And he says, the first paragraph is, “I wrote this book to stop answering questions about, ‘How do you produce a kid like Bill Gates, Jr?'” And it’s called Showing Up For Life, and that’s what he says. He’s like, “I just showed up for my kid’s childhood, Bill showed up for his whole thing, and the rest just kind of fell into place.
Jill DeWit: Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Steven Butala: I wish it was that simple.
Jill DeWit: Or it’s true.
Matt Rogers: And I think a lot of it, too, is just, there’s that saying, “Be where your feet are,” right? So, wherever you are, try to be present, and if you’re doing a deal and you’re talking to somebody, and… you know, you talk to so many different people in this business that if you’re distracted, and it happens. You could have 10 deals going on at once, and the phone’s ringing, and you’ve got emails flying in, but if you’re able to just kind of hone in and connect with the person you’re speaking with on the phone or whatever that is, it really shows.
Matt Rogers: If you feel distracted by what you’re doing, people pick up on that, you know? And it doesn’t foster a good relationship, especially when you’re trying to buy or sell something for what we buy and sell for.
Jill DeWit: Exactly.
Steven Butala: Everybody remembers their first deal. What was your first deal like?
Matt Rogers: It’s funny, because it took me about a little over two weeks to finish the training, and once I got through the videos, I just said, “Okay, you know what? I’m putting the mailer out. We’ll see what happens.”
Matt Rogers: And I mailed… I did it exactly how you guys taught, and I did three counties, 1,500 mailers, 500 each county to diversify, and the first two counties, I bombed. Those were the first ones that came back, and I got a bunch of hate, and one county, I had no response. It’s like I didn’t even mail it. It’s like the mail never showed up; it did, obviously, because I sent myself a letter. And I just got nothing! It was kind of weird.
Matt Rogers: And then, about a week later I started getting calls, and I mailed some county in Tennessee in the middle of nowhere. I don’t even know how I picked it. And I started getting deals! And the very first deal was exactly as you taught in the original Cash Flow from Land program. Some lady calls and says, “Hey, I have a 1.2 acres, it’s in the middle of nowhere, I’ve never been to it. My mom died and left it to me. I have nothing I’m going to do with this. I’m just paying taxes on it for no reason.” The taxes were nothing; they were, like, 12 bucks.
Matt Rogers: But she just said it was a hassle, and, “Sure, I will take your $1,200 offer. When can I sign, and when can I get paid?”
Steven Butala: That’s it!
Jill DeWit: Perfect!
Matt Rogers: And that’s exactly what happened. And I bought it from her, and she… The way you talk about it in the original program, it happened to a tee. And I put it on Facebook, I put it on Craigslist; I didn’t really have any kind of business structure set up. I did it in my own name, and it took about six weeks, and some guy bought it for four grand.
Jill DeWit: There you go!
Steven Butala: Wow.
Jill DeWit: Haha!
Steven Butala: You can’t pay for that kind of testimonial.
Jill DeWit: That’s it. Yeah. And then, that started the whole thing.
Matt Rogers: Yeah, it started the whole thing. And to be honest, it was the longest six weeks, because I had no idea how long this is supposed to take.
Jill DeWit: Right.
Matt Rogers: A lot of the things we talk about is trying to get out in under 30 days, and that doesn’t always happen, but I got to the 30-day mark and I’m like, “Ooh, is anybody going to buy this?” I’d been getting calls, and I was nervous talking to a potential buyer because I didn’t really know what I was talking about. Kind of had impostor syndrome, almost. You’re just kind of faking it and trying to figure out what you’re doing.
Matt Rogers: And some guy came along, said, “Hey, I know where this is and I just want to park my camper there, and there’s no restrictions, and where can I pay you?”
Steven Butala: Did you get a check, did you get a wire transfer, did you put it in your personal bank account? Did you roll it into the next deal? I’m asking these silly questions, Matt, because we live close to each… I can ask you these kinds of questions and I can’t ask some other members these kinds of things.
Steven Butala: Give us the details, because everybody loves that.
Jill DeWit: Yeah.
Matt Rogers: Yeah! No, it’s not silly at all. I had a mobile notary go out and meet the guy, and did the deed just like Jill talked about in the original Cash Flow program. And the guy handed her over a cashier’s check, and she, I had a FedEx envelope waiting for the notary to overnight it back to me.
Steven Butala: Just like the program!
Matt Rogers: She sent it right back and I went to the bank and two days later, it was in the account.
Jill DeWit: Love it!
Steven Butala: What’s your favorite part of this business model, and your least favorite part?
Jill DeWit: That’s a good question.
Matt Rogers: I really struggle sitting in front of the computer and scrubbing data. And I do it, you have to do it, there’s no way around it. It’s not my favorite thing to do. I don’t hate it, because I’ve kind of gotten in a rhythm of how I like to do things. And I don’t know if that’s how other people do them. There’s probably a much more efficient way to do it, which I would actually love to learn from other members.
Matt Rogers: But I just kind of have my own system, and I find an area, download a ton of data, sit down for a day or two, scrub it all out, price it, and I kind of like to be out and about, and I’ll go ride my bike on the beach, walk on the beach, take my dogs out, and then I can do business on my phone, right? I can answer calls and emails from pretty much anywhere, which is the great part, but that’s what I love about this business. You can be anywhere! It’s great.
Jill DeWit: That’s great.
Steven Butala: What’s your favorite part?
Matt Rogers: Kind of a long-winded answer…
Steven Butala: Aside from cashing the checks, what’s your favorite part?
Matt Rogers: You know what’s really cool, is I’ve had a couple of sellers come back to me… or, sorry, buyers, people I’ve sold to, and one guy in particular, this is kind of a cool story. I had this kind of weird three-acre property that was landlocked, and probably bought it for nothing. I bought it for 2,000 bucks, and it was a little over three acres in Tennessee. It had a really cool creek running towards the bottom of it, but there was really no way to access it. The only easement was a guy had a fence up, and I sent a photographer out to go look at it, and the guy wouldn’t get through.
Matt Rogers: The guy came out with a shotgun and was like, “You’re not going past this gate.”
Matt Rogers: And the photographer said, “No problem.” Okay? Turned around and hightailed it back, and so I got no photos.
Matt Rogers: And I just did some Google screenshots and things like that. Ended up selling it to a guy. He bought it. Wasn’t quite sure what he was buying, but he thought he liked it. And I ended up giving him the info for the guy who owns the property on this side, right, that has street access. And I said, “I don’t know if this guy’s interested in selling, but I have access to his information. Call him and see if he’ll sell to you, and then you’ll have six acres with road from it, and power.”
Matt Rogers: And sure enough, this guy called him for six months. Finally got a hold of him, and the guy goes, “Where have you been? I’ve been dying to sell this thing. I bought it for my dad. He just died. It has septic on it. It’s literally ready to go.”
Matt Rogers: And this guy turned around and bought it from him for 10 grand! So, I sold him three acres and then put him in position to buy three more acres. He called me a month ago and was almost crying, really nice guy, and was just like, “You have no idea what you did for my family and I. We live in Illinois. We’re trying to get down to Tennessee, and we now own six acres with septic on it, and we can literally go move and build our little house on there immediately.” He’s like, “I just can’t thank you enough.”
Jill DeWit: That’s so cool!
Steven Butala: This is why I was excited of talk with you this morning, because this is what happens to Jill all the time. You guys approach this like you just create transactions.
Jill DeWit: Right.
Steven Butala: And I do not approach this this way at all, and it’s fascinating for me. If I had to guess, the majority of the people that are in our group are data people, because that’s just how we sell this. You know? That’s what we talk about. But it takes personality, and Jill just doesn’t stop! You don’t stop. And that’s what I think, you just, you created a transaction that changed somebody’s life.
Jill DeWit: Exactly.
Steven Butala: It’s not just real estate deals that we do, you know?
Jill DeWit: Well, you saw, Matt just said, we just did some shows on this that are coming up, that you’re solving a problem for the seller, and you’re solving a problem for that buyer! You solved it for him, and you came in at the right price, and he couldn’t be happier, and that’s so cool.
Steven Butala: By the time this airs, those shows will have aired, and they’re called Solving Problems for A Buyer, one show, and Solving Problems for A Seller. And that’s what we do.
Jill DeWit: Right.
Steven Butala: It’s not a real estate agent thing.
Jill DeWit: Nope.
Steven Butala: We don’t maximize price, or put up curtains and stuff.
Jill DeWit: Exactly.
Steven Butala: We’re really… You described your first deal; that’s perfect, you solved that woman’s problem.
Jill DeWit: Yep.
Matt Rogers: And it was simple. I didn’t have to do a whole lot. I just sent her a check, and she sent me the deed, and I had recorded it myself and did all that fun stuff, and turn around, sold it in six weeks.
Jill DeWit: Great. I want to hear some of the deals that you’re doing now. I know you’ve taken it to another level, so if you would share with us what you’ve got going on.
Matt Rogers: Well, let me say first that for, let’s say, maybe the first nine, 10 months, was kind of toiling in the buy-for-two, sell-for-eight, which is fantastic margins. There’s nothing wrong with that at all in that world. And then I just decided I wanted to try to do a little bit more, and what really inspired me was coming to the live event in last October.
Jill DeWit: Oh, I’m so glad.
Matt Rogers: And it’s really kind of odd, because you work on this island, you’re all by yourself kind of in your office, and you wonder, “Does anybody know or care what I’m doing?” Of course you’re selling, you’re buying and selling properties, but at the end of the day, I mean, honestly, it’s kind of a lonely business, you know?
Matt Rogers: Obviously, you two work together and you have a team so you have people to bounce stuff off of and get stuff done. I’m kind of a one-man band, and it kind of wears on you sometimes. So, going to the live event and meeting a bunch of people who literally said the exact same thing… Everybody was like, people couldn’t have been happier to meet each other! Thank you for that. That was really cool.
Jill DeWit: Aw! I’m so glad.
Matt Rogers: And out of that, I made several business partners. I’ve done deals with probably three or four different people in the group since then, and we’ve all made money, and, hey.
Jill DeWit: Yep.
Steven Butala: Are you coming to that one…
Jill DeWit: You’re coming!
Steven Butala: Is it in October, Jill?
Jill DeWit: [inaudible 00:16:50] You know about the next October, right?
Matt Rogers: I’ll be there.
Jill DeWit: Okay, I know.
Steven Butala: Perfect. Yeah.
Jill DeWit: Exactly.
Steven Butala: Do you wake up in the morning now and just… It’s all standing on its own legs now, right? You’re making enough money to…
Matt Rogers: Oh, yeah! Oh, yeah.
Steven Butala: You’re in for life, kind of thing?
Matt Rogers: I’m not sure we covered that earlier, but when I stopped working in production, I didn’t necessarily aim to start doing this to replace working in production full-time. It just kind of happened.
Matt Rogers: The first six months were a little lean, turning deals and making a few bucks here and there and stuff like that. But I had savings set aside from having worked for a while, and that wasn’t really that big a deal. But over the course of the last six to eight months, there’s definitely enough money coming in now where if I want to work in the production world again, I can. And be choosy about what I do, as opposed to years ago, having to take whatever job came down the pipeline as a freelancer because you need the money, or whatever it may be.
Matt Rogers: And just for the record, I haven’t worked in production in two years, so I’ve been doing this… You could say full-time for a year, year and a half, but really, I feel like the focus has been the last six to eight months, really making some money.
Jill DeWit: That’s cool.
Steven Butala: You guys don’t have any kids, right?
Matt Rogers: No kids, no.
Steven Butala: Do you wake up in the morning and just look at yourself in the mirror and say, “Man, I figured this all out”?
Matt Rogers: No, not at all.
Steven Butala: “I have some awesome dogs, and I love my wife, and I don’t have any children, and I buy and sell land, and I can go to the beach today.”
Jill DeWit: Yeah.
Matt Rogers: That part’s cool, yes. That part is great. In terms of [inaudible 00:18:29] or not, absolutely not. I still feel like I don’t know what I’m doing, but…
Steven Butala: You do, actually.
Matt Rogers: You know, it’s pretty simple. The great thing about the original Cash Flow for Land program was you made everything so linear. You and Jill very easily spelled out A to B to C to D, and just follow the steps and you can kind of get creative and improvise after you get the basics down.
Jill DeWit: Yep.
Matt Rogers: And I feel like a lot of the people I talked to in our group kind of have their own way they do things, and so do I, but it’s really cool to learn how different people do different things, especially once you get out of the beginner phase and know that you can kind of put your own little spin on how you like to operate.
Steven Butala: Yeah. I mean, once you get the confidence to turn deals on your own and make it your own, which is obviously what you’ve done, you’re in advanced group and that’s why, because everybody in advanced group’s got a different opinion about the same deal.
Jill DeWit: Right.
Steven Butala: And that’s what I think, that creativity, I’m sure that’s what happened in production, too. [inaudible 00:19:31] production. You bring that creativity to it, and that’s what makes it come alive.
Matt Rogers: Well, this is better because at the end of the day, there’s a scoreboard, right? You can see the dollars you make, you can see what you buy for, see what you sell for, and there’s a scoreboard involved. In production, which I love; the creative aspect of entertainment and making television and all that is great, but there’s no scoreboard! It’s all subjective.
Matt Rogers: You make something and then it disappears into the abyss, and you don’t see it for a year, and then it shows up on TV, and then you might now know how something got edited or whatever the end product might be, you sometimes don’t have any control over. Well, here, you have all the control, which is awesome. I love it.
Steven Butala: There’s no way to explain that to somebody who’s never been through it, because we’re talking into a camera right now and it’s actually fun. This is unusual to talk to somebody in an interview.
Jill DeWit: Right.
Steven Butala: But the vast majority of what we do is just talking into a camera, and you’re just, “I don’t know if that worked or not.”
Jill DeWit: Right.
Steven Butala: We’re coming up on Show 1,000, so it must be working, right?
Matt Rogers: Let me tell you, it works. Whatever-
Steven Butala: [inaudible 00:20:40] just nothing that comes back.
Jill DeWit: Yeah.
Matt Rogers: I know. It’s tough. But you also have, you two have a direct line to the people you’re talking to, whether it be the member call, the advanced call, other avenues of communication that you have. I feel like you guys are definitely able to get the feedback, I’m sure, if you really want, and I’m sure some people aren’t shy about giving it to you, I’m sure also.
Steven Butala: No, they’re not shy at all! It’s funny you mentioned the original program, the Cash Flow from Land program, a few times now and we never get any positive feedback on that. We only get positive feedback on version one and version two, you know, 1.0 and 2.0. And it’s interesting that…
Steven Butala: Because you must think, because I put that together and I’d look back on it now and it seems disjointed, and it’s interesting that you see it as a linear thought process. That’s how I see it, but a lot of people… It’s a lot longer than the other stuff that we’ve produced.
Matt Rogers: Well, I think also, some of the technology and data services and a lot of that, has just rapidly changed since then, so part of it is kind of dated with that, but the nuts and bolts of it are the same. You’re downloading data, scrubbing it, pricing it properly, and sending out offers, right? That’s the lifeblood of this.
Steven Butala: That’s it.
Matt Rogers: So, if you don’t continue to do that, then you’re not going to get any deals.
Steven Butala: Right.
Jill DeWit: Exactly. What’s going on now? What are your goals for this year, and what are you working on?
Matt Rogers: I’m working on quite a bit right now. I’ve done some partnerships with a few other of the advanced members in the group. Just did a deal in Sacramento that closed last month, with one of the advanced members that took about 90 days to tell. It was a commercial property and we got in at a really good price, and ended up, we doubled our money almost. And probably could have got a little more for it, but we ended up…
Steven Butala: [crosstalk 00:22:37]
Matt Rogers: Well, the crazy thing is, it was in the middle of the city of Sacramento, and as we know… I’ve never dealt with this before, so this was all new to me. Homeless people had busted through the fence on our property and set up a little camp, and it took a couple of weeks for the police to shoo them out, and they trashed the property.
Jill DeWit: Oh!
Matt Rogers: And so, I ended up getting a letter from the city saying, “Hey, you have 30 days to clean this up or you’re going to start getting fined pretty heavily.” And this is right around the time we started talking to a buyer who was as flaky as they come, and he ended up kind of buying at the 11th hour at… we’re literally a week or two away from having to figure out, “Do we get people up there and go clean this up? What do we do?”
Matt Rogers: It’s long-distance for both me and the partner on the deal, and just something we really didn’t want to deal with. And of course, we told the buyer what was happening, and he was getting such a smoking deal on it, we doubled our money and he got a smoking deal on it! So, you know, I know that’s what is talked about a lot, is make sure your buyer gets a good deal, too. This guy got a great deal.
Matt Rogers: And we said, “Hey, part of the great deal is, this is now your problem.”
Matt Rogers: And he said okay.
Steven Butala: Can you share the numbers with us? What you bought it for?
Matt Rogers: Yeah! We bought it for 27,000 and sold it for 56,000.
Steven Butala: And what is it worth?
Matt Rogers: We had it originally listed at 80. We thought it was actually worth closer to 100. There were some other commercial properties in the area that were going for somewhere between 80 and 100, but they were kind of longer days on market. And we had a couple of false starts with some buyers in the 65 to 70,000 range that kind of flaked out for whatever reason.
Matt Rogers: And so, this guy came around and kind of… I don’t want to say he low-balled us, but he shot us a number and we said, “Hey, look, okay…”
Matt Rogers: Well, around the time that we started getting violation notices, 55 grand didn’t sound that bad. 56, whatever it was. Somewhere in between there. So, we took it and doubled our money, and got out inside 90 days, and who’s going to complain about that, right?
Steven Butala: Yeah.
Jill DeWit: Exactly. Exactly. That’s awesome.
Steven Butala: How many deals are you doing right now? Just ballpark.
Matt Rogers: I have two deals that are closing on the sales side right now that are going to be pretty nice, and I have four I currently own that I’m selling, two of which are problem properties that I should have never bought.
Steven Butala: Yep. We’ve all had those. All of us. Even at this stage in our career, we are dealing with, there’s one property…
Jill DeWit: Yep. Oh, yeah.
Steven Butala: We are spending… I bet we’ve put together 10 hours on this thing.
Jill DeWit: It’s driving me nuts. Yeah.
Steven Butala: Anyway, go ahead.
Matt Rogers: But that’s where you learn! Right? You don’t learn from your successes; you learn from the failures. And this is kind of a funny story.
Matt Rogers: I [inaudible 00:25:16] a county just outside of Nashville. I do a lot of work in Tennessee. And this guy gets back to me and says, “Hey, I got two acres, would love to sell to you. The county-assessed value’s 18 grand.” I got him down to 10 grand.
Matt Rogers: And I never saw, I never had anybody go out and look at it, which is a huge mistake. I’m not doing that anymore. You have to have somebody go out and look at the property.
Steven Butala: Yeah.
Matt Rogers: I just kind of bought it completely sight unseen, and I’ve been sitting on it for six months now, and I can’t sell. I’m going to end up taking a thousand or $2,000 hit on it, but basically, I bought it with the intention of, this old man was telling me, “Hey, I have a hundred more properties that I’m willing to sell to you, but let’s get this one in the books first.”
Matt Rogers: And we got it in the books, and then kind of disappeared shortly after that, so I’m guessing this was his problem property, too.
Steven Butala: Yeah.
Matt Rogers: So, shame on me! You know? Now I know better. If we’re going to do it, and you’ve discussed it before, get a release. Get a list of properties, very specific; “What are you going to sell me next after I buy this?” And get a release signed on both sides.
Steven Butala: Yeah.
Jill DeWit: Yeah.
Steven Butala: What’s wrong with this one? Why isn’t it selling?
Matt Rogers: It’s heavily… Well, [inaudible 00:26:28]. It’s almost two acres, but it’s very narrow, so the property hugs almost too much of the street, and it’s pretty heavily sloped. And you can put a mobile on it, which is great. The problem is, somebody’s going to have to spend some money for some dirt work to put a pad on there.
Matt Rogers: And I’ve had… I’m not kidding. I’ve had 40 to 50 people go out and look at this thing. And even when I had it listed at 20 grand, people thought it was a smoking deal, and they went out, took one look, and said, “Nah. No, thanks.”
Jill DeWit: Sucks!
Matt Rogers: But that’s okay, you know. I’m going to end up at least breaking even or maybe losing a few thousand, and this is going to be the first deal that’s really gone sideways, so…
Jill DeWit: Right.
Matt Rogers: Not a big deal.
Jill DeWit: Exactly.
Steven Butala: I know you’re looking at a lot of properties in San Diego County. Did you have success there?
Matt Rogers: No, I didn’t. All the properties that came back on that one just had… I might have been a little gun-shy about a couple of them, that maybe somebody else might have done. But the ones that came back that were looking to sell just didn’t feel like great properties, and there would be something, I feel like, that would have prevented me from selling them. And down there, people know their worth a little bit more than maybe out in the sticks somewhere else.
Matt Rogers: And there are deals to be had, I know Luke does a ton of deals down there, but I’ve only mailed it once and did a pretty hefty mailer, and just nothing really worked out for me there.
Steven Butala: San Diego County, in my opinion, a lot like Los Angeles County. The terrain is very, very, very diverse. There’s a lot of property that was subdivided, and it has an APN associated with it that’s completely non-usable in a massive metropolitan area.
Steven Butala: And so, I’ve been kicking around, Jill and I have been kicking around the idea, and I know this. And I know this because I’ve mailed both of those counties, and we’ve actually hit a couple out of the park, but the vast majority are… No one’s ever going to be able to use this property! I’ve been kicking around the idea of doing some advanced content, or I don’t know what we would call it, some type of content that shares that experience to help people in the future kind of avoid it or not.
Steven Butala: But Luke’s killing it there, and it’s just not for you, but you’re killing it in Tennessee, and I’m sure there’s some people in Tennessee that just couldn’t make it work for whatever reason, so…
Jill DeWit: Totally!
Steven Butala: Then I ultimately decided not to do it, because of those things, you know?
Jill DeWit: Exactly.
Steven Butala: It’s to each his own, kind of thing.
Jill DeWit: Yep.
Matt Rogers: Absolutely! And it’s just one of those things where the properties that came back with willing sellers just didn’t feel like a great fit for what I was trying to do. And that’s fine.
Matt Rogers: There’s other areas of the country that… maybe more kind of desert-y properties in San Bernardino, or Riverside or something, where it’s a little more flat and there’s just kind of a desert square. But I’ve never really nailed those, either, so I’ve always kind of stayed, honestly… I’ve done some Sacramento stuff, but other then that, east of the Mississippi, really, is where I’ve done most of my work.
Steven Butala: Eastern San Diego County and Los Angeles, northeastern Los Angeles County, we’ve done great there. It’s flat and usable.
Jill DeWit: Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Steven Butala: It’s everybody’s… It’s whatever makes sense to you.
Jill DeWit: Isn’t that funny? We all have different things. Justin’s like, “I don’t do desert property.”
Steven Butala: Yeah!
Jill DeWit: He’s real vocal about that. I understand!
Matt Rogers: No, absolutely. And I don’t have anything against desert property at all, and there’s people making a killing out there doing tons of deals with it. I just, my first mailer that hit and got me traction happened to be in Tennessee, so I just kept mailing Tennessee, and kept getting deals.
Matt Rogers: As I branched out to look at other areas, I’ve done deals in different states besides Tennessee, but that’s been the one that’s been the best so far, for me.
Jill DeWit: That’s cool.
Steven Butala: Where are you from in Indiana?
Matt Rogers: I’m from Indianapolis.
Steven Butala: Okay. Have you considered mailing there?
Matt Rogers: It’s funny you say that. I did mail the surrounding areas. I had some properties that came back, and this was during the in-fills. I was doing almost exclusively in-fill mailers for about six months, and I had really good success with it the first three months, and then kind of tailed off pretty hard the last three months.
Matt Rogers: And in central Indiana there, I struck out. There was a few lots that I could have bought, but their price just didn’t quite work out. But I’ve since kind of gone into bigger acreage, and I’ve mailed areas in southern Indiana, which I know pretty well, where I went to school. And actually working with a realtor in the area, and he works exclusively with land. So, he and I have kind of developed a game plan for areas to target, areas he knows, and the mails I was going to hit this week.
Steven Butala: What’s the deal? You have a land-specific realtor. What’s the deal that you kind of cut with him?
Jill DeWit: Yeah.
Matt Rogers: He tells me where the good spots are to mail, I mail them, and if I buy them, he lists them.
Jill DeWit: Perfect!
Steven Butala: That’s great! So, you’re solving that problem.
Jill DeWit: That’s great!
Steven Butala: Is it working out?
Matt Rogers: Well, we’re going to see. I literally just sent my first mailer out that we’ve kind of… I don’t want to say we worked on together; I did it, but he gave me some good parameters of areas to look at, and kind of what price per acre would be in these areas, so it really helped me with my pricing. He’s a great guy, too.
Matt Rogers: Yeah, there’s two lots that I’m about to close on in that area from a previous mailer a month ago that he’s going to list for me. We’re going to see how these first couple go, but so far, it’s been good, and I had not really worked in realtors a ton, but in this case, it feels like it might be something that can be very beneficial for both of us.
Jill DeWit: That’s wonderful! Commercial or residential? Or both?
Matt Rogers: This is all residential.
Jill DeWit: Okay.
Matt Rogers: Some ag land.
Steven Butala: You know, when you can remove… I look at real estate investment in three stages. There’s acquisition, engineering or marketing, and sales. And when you can remove two of those… because I’m very, very good at acquisitions. I’ve spent my whole professional career in some, one way or another, in acquisitions. And I have also spent all of that time attempting to remove the engineering and the sales piece.
Steven Butala: And I’ve successfully did that with Jill.
Jill DeWit: Yeah! Here I am!
Steven Butala: And it quadrupled the volume, probably quintupled, the volume that I did before we had this partnership. So, I hope that-
Matt Rogers: That’s huge!
Steven Butala: With you.
Jill DeWit: Yeah.
Matt Rogers: No, absolutely. And the way you two work, seem to complement each other very well, which is fantastic. And I probably skew more towards Jill’s side. I enjoy the people part of things. I don’t dislike the data. I’ve learned to work with it, and how to use it, and make it work for me. Which is great! It’s been actually really fun to learn. Which, I’ve enjoyed that part of it. It’s just not something that comes really naturally to me, so I have to kind of push through to make sure that gets done.
Matt Rogers: But it has to get done, or no deals!
Jill DeWit: Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Steven Butala: Matt, you’re welcome in our office anytime. You don’t have to be lonely up in El Segundo by yourself.
Jill DeWit: Yeah!
Steven Butala: I’m serious. And we don’t say that to anybody!
Jill DeWit: Yeah, it’s true.
Steven Butala: I’m serious. You want to come over and screw around and I’ll take you to lunch and stuff, we’re so close.
Jill DeWit: Yeah.
Matt Rogers: Yeah! No, absolutely. I love any chance I get to get out of the house, usually around lunchtime or something, and get a little fresh air before I go back into the hole and stare at a screen for another four or five hours.
Steven Butala: So, if you go from El Segundo where you are, go straight to the beach, turn left on The Strand and take it til it ends, that’s our office.
Matt Rogers: That’s Redondo.
Steven Butala: Well, you’ve done it again, spend another 20 minutes or so, probably more than that, listening to The Land Academy Show. Join us next time for another interesting episode.
Jill DeWit: And we answer your questions posted on our online community, LandInvestors.com. It’s free.
Steven Butala: You are not alone in your real estate ambition, Matt. You’re not alone, pal. You don’t have to be lonely there.
Jill DeWit: Exactly!
Matt Rogers: Oh, cry me a river.
Steven Butala: Yeah.
Matt Rogers: This is no… I’m not looking for any tears, but it’s, yeah, for somebody who’s used to working with people a lot, it takes some getting used to to work by yourself. But when you’re on the phone and you’re actually communicating with people, that’s great. I like that part.
Jill DeWit: Exactly.
Matt Rogers: And the money’s great.
Jill DeWit: And you could do it from anywhere! You could pack up your laptop and go sit on the beach if you really want to.
Matt Rogers: Which is the part I love the most. My wife and I can travel and I can keep my phone on me and do deals from anywhere. It’s fantastic.
Steven Butala: You know, last time we met, incidentally, talking about your wife, she loves her job and wants to work, right?
Matt Rogers: Yeah! No, she has a very good job at a big company here in the South Bay, and she’s been there about 15 years now, and is climbing up the ladder and doing very well. And yeah, no, she really likes her job, and she works with some great people, and she enjoys the structure of that world, which is great for her. And I’ve never been like that, though. I’ve always been…
Matt Rogers: I’ve never really enjoyed nine-to-fives. I just have always kind of done my own thing, even in production, which are crazy, weird hours. I don’t mind those, as long as I don’t have to show up to an office and be told, “You have to be here by eight, and you can’t leave here until 5:01.” That drives me nuts. I can’t stand that.
Matt Rogers: I will work 12 hours, 14 hours a day, I don’t care, but I don’t need somebody hanging over my shoulder telling me when to do that.
Jill DeWit: Exactly.
Steven Butala: I know where she works, too, and we don’t need to name names, but it’s the darling of South Bay, you know? That company. So, it’s got to be really fun to show up there, I would think, as an outsider looking in, and really succeed. Because it’s rapidly growing, it’s a breadwinner for…
Matt Rogers: Oh, yeah. No, absolutely.
Steven Butala: [inaudible 00:36:08] pretty good, too.
Jill DeWit: Yeah.
Matt Rogers: Yeah! No, no complaints at all. We’re very lucky, we live in an awesome area, we have a lot of awesome friends, great life. Things are fantastic, and this…
Matt Rogers: And a lot of it, honestly, is attributed to finding you guys, and working on land and buying and selling, it’s opened up a whole other avenue for me. It’s like, I’ve started a second career! And it’s really cool. It’s all in my hands, too, so I can work as much or as little as I want and how much I’m going to make is dependent on that. And I know it.
Matt Rogers: The next part is getting to the point where I don’t have to be as hands-on, and get some people in place to do some of the nuts and bolts, where I can just rubber-stamp some things and push them through, or say yes or no. And not kind of have to grind it out every day.
Matt Rogers: Which, I really don’t feel like it’s a grind, but you know what I’m saying.
Jill DeWit: Exactly.
Steven Butala: Yep.
Jill DeWit: Awesome. Well, thank you again for coming, and wherever you’re watching or wherever you’re listening, please rate us there.
Steven Butala: We are Steve and Jill!
Jill DeWit: We are Steve and Jill.
Steven Butala: Information-
Jill DeWit: And inspiration-
Steven Butala: To buy undervalued property.
Jill DeWit: I lost my place.
Steven Butala: Thanks again, Matt. It’s awesome talking to you.
Matt Rogers: Yeah, no, absolutely! Thank you so much. I hope that went well. I feel like it did.
Steven Butala: It went great. It was perfect.
Jill DeWit: It went awesome! Yeah, I’ll see you in about an hour and 20.
Matt Rogers: Yeah! I’ll be on the call here at one o’clock, so thank you so much. I really appreciate it.
Steven Butala: All right. See you.
Jill DeWit: Bye.
Matt Rogers: Okay. See you.
If you enjoyed the podcast, please review it in iTunes . Reviews are incredibly important for rankings on iTunes. My staff and I read each and every one.
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